The biggest Crankworx of all the Crankworxes went out with a bang last week as Emil Johansson took another big win and Tomas Lemoine brought back big, but there was also a busy week of bikes before Sunday's Red Bull Joyride. Episode 139 sees Alicia, Kazimer, Henry, and I chat about how our Crankweeks went, from riding prototype drivetrains to racing the EWS to Kazimer dancing in a nightclub.
Got a question about Crankworx Whistler? Or any question? Post it below and we'll maybe answer it in an upcoming Q&A episode.
THE PINKBIKE PODCAST // EPISODE 139 - CRANKWORX WRAP-UP AND BIKES FOR THE ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE August 18th, 2022
Just jump over the whole damn thing.
Featuring a rotating cast of the editorial team and other guests, the Pinkbike podcast is a weekly update on all the latest stories from around the world of mountain biking, as well as some frank discussion about tech, racing, and everything in between.
This week's Pinkbike Podcast is presented by Yakima.
THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU Henry!!! I'm with you on slopestyle being uninteresting. For me it's two reasons:
1) It's a judged sport. Most people don't like this. Someone winning by 0.1 points does nothing other than make me wonder what would happen with a different set of judges.
2) It's hard to tell the difference. The tricks are so complicated, yet similar that I need someone guiding me through the broadcast, telling me that it was the first ever opposite double truck no hander can-can. If I can't tell what specifically made the winning run so great I lose interest. That's what made Lemoine's super huck so amazing. I knew straight away that it was amazing--didn't need to wait for the judges to decide if Emil's extra bar spin put him over the top.
Yes, slopestyle is super hard. 100%. I can barely get my wheels off the ground. But that doesn't make it interesting and fun to watch.
Big facts from Henry. It's gymnastics on bikes, which is no shade toward the amount of skill these guys have, but I just don't care. Even if I could tell what the riders were actually doing in the moment, I think I'd still prefer watching simpler tricks done with style (big straight airs, awesome scrubs, slow 360s, etc).... but that doesn't really lend itself to a competition format.
@mtbinthevan, have you watched slopestyle in person? I don't usually watch that many slopestyle videos, but in real life it's super impressive, even if I can't always keep track of all the flips and spins. Joyride is definitely worth checking out if you get a chance.
I don't think this needs to be some great 'holier than thou' debate - there are plenty of other competitive forms of mountain biking to follow if slopestyle doesn't do it for you.
While in some ways, I agree with Henry and some of his critiques of slopestyle (not of EWS), I feel like it's somewhat pointless to create unnecessary, and what I would consider to be, false hierarchies within riding.
More people on bikes is a good thing. Full stop.
Events like Joyride, and Crankworx in general, will always be highly entertaining to both a subset of the biking community, but also a large amount of non-riders. I know countless people, and young families, who attend Crankworx Whistler even if they do not ride bikes. Do they understand, and can they explain, the difference between a triple truckdriver and an oppo tailwhip to x-up? No, but they are stoked on the event, and hopefully they are more fired up to do some form of biking.
Would I rather watch a DH or XC race than a slopestyle competition? Yes, but I'm not going to say the slope competition shouldn't exist.
@mtbinthevan: When Redbull shows the slow-mo replays it gets a whole lot more impressive because then my slow brain can comprehend what the hell I just saw
Yes it is subjective, but this opinion is like saying racing isn't interesting to watch because they are all just riding the same track? The difference is everyone can ride down a track, so they understand how hard it must be for the faster guys. But not everyone can do a 360 or a backflip.
I have an appreciation for slopestyle because I can do simple tricks (360, no footer, backflip).So I understand how much harder it must be to do the tricks these guys are doing. If you've never done anything similar, it would be hard to comprehend how hard they are, and that's what the commentator's job is. If you don't understand it, that's fine, but it's definitely interesting. I don't find equestrian sports interesting because I know nothing about them.
So I think Henry (and people that agree with him) just need to get out there and try some of the tricks, or try and ride a slope course to understand how skilled these guys are.
But people, we are missing one very important point, slopestyle has become "Who's going to come second to Emile?". That's why I love Rampage, there is so much more scope for creativity, it's not who can jam as many flippy and spinny things together before they land...
In the DTPD Martin brought up an interesting idea to apply for DH World Cups the hierarchy of MotoGP and introduce a transfer logic.
To me it seems this has been already applied to the EWS with EWS100 and 80. To organise an event for only 40 riders does not make any sense. So extending the number of competitors makes totally sense let them pay to fund the event. They get on track experience and can attend the elite race on Sunday as spectator.
You have qualifier event for the EWS in the regional events, but it would be interesting if you could collect point in the EWS100 and 80 and then move up a league.
So the contest is so high level you don’t get it? So because it’s not made for “you” it shouldn’t exist? That is the most self centered idea in the world. Nothing should exist out there unless it is tailored to “you”. Dude take a step back and think about that. F*Ct sake PB….
@cougar797: We share our opinions on the podcast, even if others don't agree with them. We're just talking, it should definitely exist and is definitely ridiculous to watch.
the Whistler courses have been similar trails from before the 80 and 100 were options, your take doesn’t hold weight, it feels like you’re just mad at people for being there?
I appreciated Henry’s EWS comments, his main ponit being that flat-out racing on gnarly, blind, and novel tracks was interesting to WC DH racers once upon a time.
@SteepJobs: it seems like the trans-madeira type events are better for this and that EWS has turned into more of a high speed, push-the-limits type of racing
I normally like Henry but the level of whinging in this episode made it the first one I've ever hit skip on. It was hard to listen to when the others are just trying to move on and he's labouring some point about a race he didn't watch on trails he's never ridden
@mikelevy I think at some point, it could be interesting to have a few different guests on the podcast who are more in the mtb trail building scene. There is a ton to talk about as far as riding, and bike tech, which is awesome, and I love it. But also another HUGE side of the sport and an essential side in responsible, trail building, and maintaining with longevity in mind. Even in my little Southeast PA region of the east coast, good trails are being built all over the place, and a few different organizations have been developing good relationships with land owners, and municipality reps. But, its a ton of work to get trail systems approved, and sometimes feels like we are "forging a new path" (pun intended) as far as the correct approach to going about building good responsible trails, and relationships within the community as our sport matures. I am always thinking about how and where trail systems could be built, I'm sure I am not the only one. More info on what to do with that kind of energy and desire to build good trails would be awesome.
@misteraustin - Yup, tons to talk about there. I had a couple of prolific trail builders lined up a month-ish ago but it didn't work out timing-wise with Quebec Field Test we were at, Crankweek, etc. But yeah, there will be some conversations like that in the very near future
Turbo levo carbon, AXS dropper post, drivetrain, flight attendant, electronics and sh** everywhere, hydraulic discs that requires plenty of bleedings, simple ply tyres, and I'm good to go.
@fartymarty: But what weapons will you have? Important details. I feel like my Ghost Grappler is perfect for this role. It's like the designed and named it with zombie fighting in mind.
@mikelevy I have a question for next podcast, or just an answer in the comments. I'm finishing my degree next spring and planning on moving to the PNW, specifically Seattle, for a post doc and to pursue the all the biking in that northern washington/southern BC area. Suppose I'm starting fresh with all new gear, what sort of clothes, jackets, shoes etc will I need out there? Does it rain as much as it seems? Would you recommend waterproof shoes? Do I need more than one rain jacket? Should I expect to have mud and grit spray all over my ass and shins after most rides? Do I need an industrial quantity of shop towels and lube for drying off my chain every day? Just curious about what you would recommend. I may or may not be a part time mechanic for a certain large bike company that starts with S, so some gear is cheaper than others...
Assuming you are 22 since you'll be graduating college... You will have lots of new expenses, especially in a high COL area. I suggest adopting a "run what you brung" mentality at first. Everyone has their own preferences. Gear is great and all, but you're at an age where your body can handle being slightly uncomfortable as you learn the ropes and find if you really need multiple rain jackets.
@what-am-i-doing: I'm actually a 27 year old PhD student. I don't mind being a little wet but if I'm going to be wet every day I'm willing to spend money to be less wet.
Vancouver Island rider here, I wear layers for warmth, but just assume you will be riding soaking wet. I usually get more water from underneath than from above on wet rides, so I don't bother to try and stay dry. Standard riding gear for the car is two or three dry towels, mainly to put on the seat for the drive home.
Oh yes and fenders in the winter, I even have a small homemade job to protect my rear suspension from grit and mud, and I clean my bike after every wet ride, gentle hose down and then a dry wipe and rough inspection, good habit over here as the riding is hard on parts..
Being a long time Lower mainland (Sunshine Coast) bike rider, I'd suggest quality gear is paramount to enjoy West Coast riding. I swear by 7mesh gear. All top notch, and specifically designed for wet and cool riding conditions (and equally designed for our Mediterranean summer/fall seasons). Bike washing tools and easy access to a hose are alos important (so if moving into an apartment/condo make sure to have hose access and a place to store a recently washed bike) Water proof booties are also helpful, as noted by @bomadics , wetness usually occurs from the bottom up, mud, puddles, creek crossings etc. By all means DM me if you any further questions etc.
@ihertzler —another PNW rider here—south Puget South area—I would agree with what others have said. I swear by waterproof socks in the winter. If I can keep my feet dry and warm I can deal with almost anything. You will be get wet, its more a matter of “how much” and “where”. I always ride with gloves, so finding waterproof gloves has been huge for me.
If you can swing it, a cheap boot warmer / dryer will pay for itself almost instantly.
I was bad at this when I moved up here, but be brave and get connected with locals who ride—they’ll let you know which places do great during our 16 months of winter and where to stay clear of.
Welcome to the area— the riding up here is pretty special!
Yeah what other said. Bellingham rains a lot more than Seattle/Snoqualmie. Waterproof shoes are nice when it's wet, but sweat too much if it's cold. Rain coats just don't work, they make you wetter. Good shorts, a couple pair of gloves, and a couple light layers of merino and you're good to go. Get good tires and a boot dryer. Squirt for chain lube. Except for November, the winter riding here can be really good.
I'm DMing you an article I wrote on winter riding in Seattle area.
@mikelevy I guess Kazimer(I don't know why I cannot just tag him directly) doesn't know that the Stache iteslf has been discontinued but has evolved into the 1120 which is exactly what he described.
Slopestyle is rad just like the other disciplines of MTB. It's just bmx on a bigger bike with more money involved for the riders and sponsors. It may not be your everyday thing, but I think should be respected just like all the other disciplines.
@mikelevy and @mikekazimer once you've finished burning Henry's fan mail (I heart Quinney) can you please consider the following for the Q&A:
1. Is the rising price of mtbs going to prevent young people entering the sport? Surely the $5k entry point means teenagers are effectively blocked from mtb, eventually leading to a diminishing number of hip-replaced old knackers bumping around on an ever decreasing number of $45k ebikes.
2. Are ebikes for 40-somethings and upward? When was the last time you saw a 21 year old bust a berm on Santa Cruz Bullit? I'm 40-something, I ride an emtb, when I smash laps on my emtb I only see other 40-something blokes. Are ebikes inaccessible to young riders or just not cool?
3. All things being equal (which I know they aren't) if you could run a shock with high progression rate and lower (relative) spring rate or (for the same "other" variables) a lower progression rate (v linear) and high spring rate, why wouldn't you run the higher progression?
Go to a dh race and you’ll see plenty of kids on e bikes. I mean their parents bought them, but they also buy everything for the kids. The kids just get to find another way of being annoying.
@tremeer023: paul comp. brakes are the most powerful and hassle free mech discs i can think of. oh, btw, my bike would have a dropper post - i'd rather go coaster brake than missing the dropper.
@tremeer023: absolutely. biggest game changer in years. i tried a lot of stuff on my hometrail hack bike and found that i can ditch anything from my bike - suspension front and rear, proper brakes, gears, grippy tires, younameit - but a mountain bike without a dropper post? over my dead body!
Question for the future Q&A: If you had the budget to go on one destination stage race (trans Madeira, Andes Pacifico, megavalanche etc) which would you choose? Very keen to do one after Kazimer’s adventures in the stone king rally.
@mikelevy question for the next podcast, I am building up a dream rig with a DH Drivetrain, and want to ruin the lives of all PB commenters by using AXS. However, I plan on using a 7 speed X01 DH drivetrain. Is it possible to put a short cage on a GX AXS derailleur and somehow limit it to 7 speeds? Or even use a road derailleur? Ive asked on multiple forums and no-one seems to be able to answer? Maybe Henry might have a solution? Thanks
@mikelevy question for next podcast, coil shock on a Stumpy Evo 2022 set up as a mullet, good, not so good? I hear mixed reviews. Quick background history, mostly riding the S2S corridor, bike park duties are delegated to a different bike. Cheers!
Question for the podcast: I've been riding Sram derailleurs for a couple of years but in April I upgraded to their 1x12 set up for the first time. Since then I have bent or broken three GX derailleurs. I tend to ride harder than most and will occasionally slide out or fall and I'm super tired of breaking these stupid parts, mostly bending the cages. There is nothing online about which company's derailleur can take a beating. It's like durability is not even a category for testing these when actually that's the most important thing. I'm hoping you can tell me which derailleur will last the longest with falls and hard riding. Sram? XT? TRP? Your advice could save my marriage or at least my sanity!
Really interesting conversation - except for the Kaz EWS 100 interview ;-). Your thoughts on Supra vs. gearboxes may be a bit outside of reality, though. Yes the gearboxes are a bit draggy, but damn do they shift fast and run reliably. And is an Enduro bike at 34# really heavy? Bradley Lauder seems to have done well in Masters EWS on a Katipo...
Zombie apocalypse bike: Actually after having gone through a disaster and losing utilities for a month, a bike was the most important item to have. First thing that happens in a disaster is the roads get clogged with debris and stay that way; all the monster survival trucks just sit parked.
Most important aspect of survival bike? Ability to carry a lot of water.
Damn @mikelevy you beat me to it, fatbike for the apocalypse, the choice isn't hard as I disassemble my suspension linkage for the 4th time this year trying to find a creak! Also I almost never smash my derailleur but the day the Supree article came out my derailleur had a run-in with a rock...
Apocalypse bike - Surly Krampus with rigid forks, silent hub, crazy alt bars that are comfy for long distances, set up with racks and a trailer so I can travel a bit with it and take it off if I want to just go ride/explore. Probably some old 10 speed drivetrain (or Micrososhift AdventX). Was also thinking about a gates drive, but then would have to go internally geared hub or gearbox and if I went that route I would look at a Priority 600X.
As for Slope, I generally don't watch it..but I love joyride and rampage (I feel rampage is more slope than what is was now). I can appreciate the complexity of what they are doing, but it gets boring...at least it's better than just straight DJ which I just can't watch much of at all.
EWS, it is what is is and if I was to enter an enduro type race I would rather enter one of the trans BC, Cascadia type where they take you all over a region and you feel like your exploring rather than racing...but that's just me.
Levy I've realised you sound like the radio presenter on Burnout 3
Henry's simple mind can't figure out any mtb disciplines that aren't just timed against the clock! He doesn't represent all brits either, BTW! He seems to like to disagree with others for the sake of it - good on Alicia for calling him out with some sensible arguments
@mikelevy, question for the podcast, an old one I don't think made it on, based on the overwhelmingly positive response to Pinkbike Racing, is this the most well recieved project / content Pinkbike has produced? What are the highs and, possibly, unexpected lows from what you've put out?
How about a two-bike challenge: at what price point would you each choose to buy two bikes with different purposes instead of one super bike, and what would they be?
you mean to tell me that danny beer has a mountain biking brother?? and put some respect on dannys name, the dude is a monster and an icon in a niche sport that has endured ostracism for some 20 years
Reason for the zombie apocalypse question. China invading Rowan will start WW3 ending when the world is in a nuclear disaster. at that point the few survivors will need to use bikes to get around places.
Interested to hear which Conti tires were used in the field test and how they were set up (casing, compound, inserts?, pressures) if you get a chance to address that in the pod!
Hands down the best apocalypse bike is a Jones Bike! Steel frame, fat/plus tires, incredible geometry/handling. Try it on your next “impossible” climb video!
Tires aren't going to last long, so no point in even wasting my time riding one, I will just run. Granted, I am also a distance runner. I will be crewing for my GF who is running 100k tomorrow (but I will be riding my bike when she doesn't need me).
Should I put a single crown fork on a downhill bike(canyon sender) as a kind of heavy enduro bike or park bike? What do you guys think about Rotor's new hydralic drivetrain?
I’m glad I switched to riding ebikes only. True mountain bikers are just wierd. I never liked to be called one actually. Listening to Henry talk just confirmed that. How anyone can talk shit about slope style is just ludicrous. It’s obviously jealousy. And he understands deep down that it’s not his little fantasy land of mountain biking and unicorns. It’s his attitude of hate slope style and I’m sure ebikes that really turns me off of this sport and it’s division. I can be honest and say that I had some wishes that crankworks should be like the old days when bearclaw 360 the road gap. But things change and slopestyle is still amazing and we should be proud that it stemmed from our sport of mountain biking. Just like ebikes have. And ebikes are awesome
I don't think it's jealousy, it's that for a lot of people (including me), slopestyle has literally nothing in common with the mtb riding they like or want to do. I'm not mad at anyone who enjoys it but my level of interest is about the same as watching figure skating or gymnastics. I'm sure they're so good at what they do that I can't even wrap my head around it, but I'd rather watch just about any other cycling discipline.
@bkm303: ebikes really don’t have anything to do with it. It’s mostly the level of emotions connected to the hatred of them. Much like Henry’s weak emotions to his dislike of slopestyle. If it’s the same as gymnastics. Then why is no one ranting about gymnastics? It’s because they are Indifferent to it. But you guys aren’t Indifferent to slopestyle. You guys actually sound like you hate it. And are in someway proud to say it. Hence jealousy. you and Henry both will never be that good at biking. And deep down your sad Inside.
1) It's a judged sport. Most people don't like this. Someone winning by 0.1 points does nothing other than make me wonder what would happen with a different set of judges.
2) It's hard to tell the difference. The tricks are so complicated, yet similar that I need someone guiding me through the broadcast, telling me that it was the first ever opposite double truck no hander can-can. If I can't tell what specifically made the winning run so great I lose interest. That's what made Lemoine's super huck so amazing. I knew straight away that it was amazing--didn't need to wait for the judges to decide if Emil's extra bar spin put him over the top.
Yes, slopestyle is super hard. 100%. I can barely get my wheels off the ground. But that doesn't make it interesting and fun to watch.
Who else stands with Henry??? I definitely do!
It's also very long time ago I watched snb slopestyle. It went the same way
I don't think this needs to be some great 'holier than thou' debate - there are plenty of other competitive forms of mountain biking to follow if slopestyle doesn't do it for you.
More people on bikes is a good thing. Full stop.
Events like Joyride, and Crankworx in general, will always be highly entertaining to both a subset of the biking community, but also a large amount of non-riders. I know countless people, and young families, who attend Crankworx Whistler even if they do not ride bikes. Do they understand, and can they explain, the difference between a triple truckdriver and an oppo tailwhip to x-up? No, but they are stoked on the event, and hopefully they are more fired up to do some form of biking.
Would I rather watch a DH or XC race than a slopestyle competition? Yes, but I'm not going to say the slope competition shouldn't exist.
Yes it is subjective, but this opinion is like saying racing isn't interesting to watch because they are all just riding the same track? The difference is everyone can ride down a track, so they understand how hard it must be for the faster guys. But not everyone can do a 360 or a backflip.
I have an appreciation for slopestyle because I can do simple tricks (360, no footer, backflip).So I understand how much harder it must be to do the tricks these guys are doing. If you've never done anything similar, it would be hard to comprehend how hard they are, and that's what the commentator's job is. If you don't understand it, that's fine, but it's definitely interesting. I don't find equestrian sports interesting because I know nothing about them.
So I think Henry (and people that agree with him) just need to get out there and try some of the tricks, or try and ride a slope course to understand how skilled these guys are.
But people, we are missing one very important point, slopestyle has become "Who's going to come second to Emile?". That's why I love Rampage, there is so much more scope for creativity, it's not who can jam as many flippy and spinny things together before they land...
Just curious about what you would recommend. I may or may not be a part time mechanic for a certain large bike company that starts with S, so some gear is cheaper than others...
If you can swing it, a cheap boot warmer / dryer will pay for itself almost instantly.
I was bad at this when I moved up here, but be brave and get connected with locals who ride—they’ll let you know which places do great during our 16 months of winter and where to stay clear of.
Welcome to the area— the riding up here is pretty special!
I'm DMing you an article I wrote on winter riding in Seattle area.
www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/bikepacking-touring-bikes/1120/1120/p/33304
1. Is the rising price of mtbs going to prevent young people entering the sport? Surely the $5k entry point means teenagers are effectively blocked from mtb, eventually leading to a diminishing number of hip-replaced old knackers bumping around on an ever decreasing number of $45k ebikes.
2. Are ebikes for 40-somethings and upward? When was the last time you saw a 21 year old bust a berm on Santa Cruz Bullit? I'm 40-something, I ride an emtb, when I smash laps on my emtb I only see other 40-something blokes. Are ebikes inaccessible to young riders or just not cool?
3. All things being equal (which I know they aren't) if you could run a shock with high progression rate and lower (relative) spring rate or (for the same "other" variables) a lower progression rate (v linear) and high spring rate, why wouldn't you run the higher progression?
If you had the budget to go on one destination stage race (trans Madeira, Andes Pacifico, megavalanche etc) which would you choose? Very keen to do one after Kazimer’s adventures in the stone king rally.
Most important aspect of survival bike? Ability to carry a lot of water.
As for Slope, I generally don't watch it..but I love joyride and rampage (I feel rampage is more slope than what is was now). I can appreciate the complexity of what they are doing, but it gets boring...at least it's better than just straight DJ which I just can't watch much of at all.
EWS, it is what is is and if I was to enter an enduro type race I would rather enter one of the trans BC, Cascadia type where they take you all over a region and you feel like your exploring rather than racing...but that's just me.
2. Question: What's the shortest ride you'll enjoy? Do you still jib around in a parking lot or cruise and hit random stairsets?
and put some respect on dannys name, the dude is a monster and an icon in a niche sport that has endured ostracism for some 20 years
“Antithesis of romance and genuine expression”. We’ll said.
I have no interest in competitive slopestyle but the slopestyle in the latest Ride or Die edit was pure expression. So good.
Tires aren't going to last long, so no point in even wasting my time riding one, I will just run. Granted, I am also a distance runner. I will be crewing for my GF who is running 100k tomorrow (but I will be riding my bike when she doesn't need me).
What do you guys think about Rotor's new hydralic drivetrain?
I don't think it's jealousy, it's that for a lot of people (including me), slopestyle has literally nothing in common with the mtb riding they like or want to do. I'm not mad at anyone who enjoys it but my level of interest is about the same as watching figure skating or gymnastics. I'm sure they're so good at what they do that I can't even wrap my head around it, but I'd rather watch just about any other cycling discipline.
You ok?